Learn to Read Greek

[Bart]

One of my colleagues wants to learn Greek and asked for my advice concerning textbooks. I used Mastronarde myself, but didn't really like it, though it's definitely a solid introduction. He's specifically interested in Attic (mainly philosophy), so I can't recommend Schroeder & Horrigan or Pharr.
So I have been looking around a bit and would like to know if someone has experience with Learn to Read Greek by Keller and Russel: http://yalepress.yale.edu/book.asp?isbn=9780300167719

It looks very thorough, appears to have lots and lots of exercises and, very important, it has an answer key.

[Paul Derouda]

It's a funny coincidence that a colleague of mine wanted to do the same and received his Keller & Russell just a week or two ago. I don't have any personal experience of the book, but at a quick glance it looked nice, with precisely the features you mention. One of the pluses of the book is that it introduces real Greek quite early on, but I don't know whether it makes the book more difficult as well.

The answer key is not for sale as far as I know, but it's a pdf or something you can get free of charge from the publisher. My colleague emailed the publisher who didn't reply very fast, and for several days in a row I had to listen to his impatient moanings, "they still haven't answered!". But then he emailed one of the authors who answered immediately. He/she was very helpful and even offered to help him with his studies!

[Scribo]

I know something of the Latin equivalent in the same series (can't recall if it was same authors), since I used it to tutor someone a while back. Rather, that was the textbook they had. I found it ok, well laid out and accessible and all that. Bear in mind though that my teaching style has always been improvisational and text based with comparatively little weight placed on the textbook. That said, I think it was a good text. Much better than the Oxford/Camb series and more expansive than Wheelock's.

[daivid]

I only have volume 2 and I should have probably bought volume 1 first as even volume 1 goes a good deal beyond the elementary stuff.

The workbook does have lots of exercises much more than most other textbooks when they get to the advanced level. However a lot are the really trivial
eg Translate these forms and phrases 1) ἐπίσταμι 2) ἠπίστατο etc. (I have set my computer to test me for this sort of thing which somehow avoids it being tedious which this kind exercise is when on the page.)
The rest were for me really difficult with some trap of Greek grammar that had me resorting to key in 90% of the cases. It would be nice to have at lest some exercises that fell between the two extremes.

The grammatical explanations are clear but a little over wordy. Other writers (eg John Taylor) are able to convey as much with fewer words.

The readings in the main book consist of unadapted extracts from Greek writers and are classified as short and longer. The longer readings are about a paragraph or two, the shorter are mainly one liners. This does allow them to be focused on the grammar being taught but I find one liners much harder as they are stripped from any context.

When I asked for the key, I got a link +password to the page where it was kept by the next day.

Both the book and the workbook are very heavy - not the sort of thing you could hold in one hand without risking wrist strain.

I probably should buy volume 1. The thing that is tipping the balance against is that the authors seem to have a strong preference for the abstract.

[Bart]

I probably should buy volume 1. The thing that is tipping the balance against is that the authors seem to have a strong preference for the abstract.

Thanks, David, but could you expand a bit on this? Do you mean abstract in their explanations or in their choice of Greek texts?

[daivid]

I probably should buy volume 1. The thing that is tipping the balance against is that the authors seem to have a strong preference for the abstract.

Thanks, David, but could you expand a bit on this? Do you mean abstract in their explanations or in their choice of Greek texts?

Αbstract in their choice of Greek texts and in the sentences that they compose for the exercises.

[frankathl]

Given your friend's interest in philosophy, I suggest you try Frank Beetham's Learning Greek with Plato, a relatively intensive beginner's course, which it should be possible to complete in about 6 months. The aims of the course(as stated in the preface) are,
...to enable a student to acquire the rudiments of Classical Greek grammar, to become accustomed to Plato's style, to begin to read Classical philosophy in Greek, to be able to relate a translation to the underlying Greek text with discrimination, and to follow a commentary on the text with understanding.
The text provides plenty of Greek to English exercises(with answers), but the meat in the sandwich is a presentation of the first part of Plato's Meno in varying size chunks(chapter 8 onwards), along with the grammar necessary for understanding. While Beetham does not translate the Meno passages for you, he provides copious notes to aid with translation, and also recommends acquiring R. W. Sharples' edition of the Meno (text and translation), which contains a near-literal English version of the Greek text.
Although this was not my first Greek textbook, I found Beetham vey helpful, with the grammatical explanations well-targeted to fulfil the book's stated aims. Of course, you also need a strong desire to want to be able to read Classical Greek philosophy in the original, but I'm confident this holds true here!

[daivid]

I finally got volume 1 of Russell and Keller's textbook.

To anyone who looking for a book to begin their study of Ancient Greek I can only say AVOID.

Having a complete phobia of "fabricated" Greek they have decided to teach the full first and second declension ουτος 1st-2nd declension adjectives, the imperfect and present both active and middle-passive and to top that the future-passive indicative, along with other stuff, before they allow their students to encounter an actual Greek sentence.

Hence of the 476 pages of the workbook devoted to exercises, the first Greek sentence appears on page 115.

It does have lots of exercises. As what I need is practice with things I sort of know this is much less of problem. I do think I will find it helpful using it basically for revision.

But as a first book, no.

[thornsbreak]

I purchased the full set of Learn to Read Greek recently, not for a first time learning of Greek, but as a comprehensive review of grammar. What I really need at this point is a lot of practice with the forms, most especially of the verbal system and 3rd declensions. What drew me to the book is seeing it has a more extensive set of exercises than almost any other. I tend to learn better by practicing forms in action and seeing them in small digestible phrases or sentences, rather than studying tables and drilling endings alone. I was hoping this one would help get me proficient with a little less pain than sheer memorization.

I have not delved in deeply yet, as I am part of Jason's study group that is currently working through Hansen and Quinn. However, I can say already from 7 units into H&Q that I don't find the exercises in that one sufficient, and I think LtRG will be a wonderful supplement. Hansen and Quinn seems to me to be a nightmare for a first time learner-- one unit will introduce the entire passive voice system! How am I supposed to master present indicative, imperfect, aorist, future, perfect, pluperfect, pres subjunctive, pres optative, aor subjunctive, aor optative, and all the infinitives in one fell swoop!!!?? And with only 27 exercise sentences? That's something like 60 different verb endings to learn in one chapter! And each form is only going to appear in maybe one drill or exercise beyond the point you see it introduced in the paradigm charts. Crazy.

I believe LtRG was written with a self-conscious attempt to be something like H&Q 2.0, and a major emphasis was to get students a lot more practice with the forms, and a lot more exposure to real, extended Greek passages than most other textbooks provide. I'm excited to work through it, and when I get the chance, I'll report back on my experience. I'm surprised by the somewhat unfavorable reception here as the reviews I read that led me to purchase the book were all highly favorable. But we'll see. Learning at home by oneself is certainly a different endeavor than receiving guidance in the classroom.

[thornsbreak]

p.s. I was also sort of wondering if anybody might be interested in getting a study group together for this textbook. I know I would be interested to work through it and if anyone else would be willing, maybe we could help each other along.

[dk2016]

If anyone still has questions about this text, please let me know. I'll be happy to answer them.

Drew Keller