I survived chapter 23 (present and future systems of -μι verbs) and thankfully it's been pretty easy since then but, in an English-to-Greek exercise in chapter 25:
For four days the sailors were able to prevent the hoplites from boarding (the ship), but on the fifth day a few fell ill, so that it was necessary for them to surrender themselves.
The answer key has for the first clause:
τέτταρας μὲν ἠμέρας ἐδύναντο οἱ ναῦται τοὺς ὁπλίτας ἁναβῆναι κωλῦσαι[,]
If I'm reading this correctly, "κωλῦσαι" is an aorist infinitive. Why, when the preventing is an ongoing operation for four days? Does it have something to do with it being the complement of "ἐδύναντο", which is imperfect?
ed: several exercises have used aorist infinitives as complements but they've always been aorist-y. This is the first, I believe, that might call for an ongoing present infinitive, but since it's in the past I guess present might not work? But the imperfect is part of the present system...
Mastronarde ch. 25
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Re: Mastronarde ch. 25
The present and the aorist only have temporal significance in the indicative. In other moods, and in the infinitive and participles, the distinction between the two forms is purely aspectual. Here, I think, the aorist is unmarked; the present would be marked as continuous or conative, or something else. The focus of the infinitives is on the simple act of preventing and boarding, which the sailors were succeeding in accomplishing for four days, while the continuity of time over which they were able to do this is conveyed by ἐδύναντο.
The aspectual systems of Greek don't necessarily correspond to those of English, but here I think in English it would seem strange to say "The sailor were able to be preventing the soldiers . . . "
The aspectual systems of Greek don't necessarily correspond to those of English, but here I think in English it would seem strange to say "The sailor were able to be preventing the soldiers . . . "
- swtwentyman
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Re: Mastronarde ch. 25
My difficulty is with "*for* four days". You can't take a point from a timeline, say 4:32pm on the third day, and say that that was the act of preventing, but rather the act of preventing went on for four days. In fact the idea of prevention is inhererently imperfective, and would seem to call for a present infinitive (going by the distinction in the tense-and-aspect chapter).
But maybe since the act of preventing was finished by the time of speaking it would be regarded as an aorist?
But maybe since the act of preventing was finished by the time of speaking it would be regarded as an aorist?
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Re: Mastronarde ch. 25
It's the difference between "for 4 days we worked at preventing them," and "for four days we succeeded at preventing them."
The present infinitive would be the first.
The present infinitive would be the first.
“One might get one’s Greek from the very lips of Homer and Plato." "In which case they would certainly plough you for the Little-go. The German scholars have improved Greek so much.”
Joel Eidsath -- jeidsath@gmail.com
Joel Eidsath -- jeidsath@gmail.com
- swtwentyman
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Re: Mastronarde ch. 25
I think I get it. Thanks to you both.