Plato Apology 35e1

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AlexEmp
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Plato Apology 35e1

Post by AlexEmp »

This sentence has been a bit tricky for me:

τὸ μὲν μὴ ἀγανακτεῖν, ὦ ἄνδρες Ἀθηναῖοι, ἐπὶ τούτῳ τῷ γεγονότι, ὅτι μου κατεψηφίσασθε, ἄλλα τέ μοι πολλὰ συμβάλλεται, καὶ οὐκ ἀνέλπιστόν μοι γέγονεν τὸ γεγονὸς τοῦτο, ἀλλὰ πολὺ μᾶλλον θαυμάζω ἑκατέρων τῶν ψήφων τὸν γεγονότα ἀριθμόν.

I'm especially confused by the μὲν. I can't grasp the nuances of why it would appear in this context. Denniston unfortunately doesn't discuss this instance.

Hylander
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Re: Plato Apology 35e1

Post by Hylander »

δὲ is withheld until νῦν δέ in 36a, although it doesn't quite yield a neat "on the one hand . . . on the other hand." Socrates gets lost in explaining his surprise that the vote was so close, and then picks up with another, slightly different, line of thought. This is how people speak in real life--not quite as cleanly and neatly as the grammar books would have you believe--and Plato is a master of giving the illusion of conversational Greek; if you want perfectly balanced μεν δε pairs, Isocrates is the place to go, or worse yet, Gorgias.

"Many factors contribute to [συμβάλλεται] my not being upset at [τὸ μὲν μὴ ἀγανακτεῖν] what happened--the fact that you voted to condemn me--and that didn't happen unexpectedly for me--but rather I'm surprised at the numbers of both the votes that emerged [θαυμάζω ἑκατέρων τῶν ψήφων τὸν γεγονότα ἀριθμόν].

A few notes:

συμβάλλεται -- "contribute to", see LSJ συμβάλλω A9:
9. generally, contribute:— Pass., . . . τὸ μὴ ἀγανακτεῖν . . ἄλλα τέ μοι πολλὰ συμβάλλεται, καὶ . . many circumstances contribute to my feeling no vexation, and especially . ., Pl.Ap.36a; . . .
http://www.perseus.tufts.edu/hopper/tex ... umba%2Fllw

ἄλλα τέ . . . πολλὰ . . . , καὶ -- Again, we have the idiom: "many things and especially . . . ."

ἀνέλπιστόν -- ἐλπίζω/ελπις are usually translated "hope" for a good thing, but they can also mean "expect/expectation" or 'fear" for a bad thing.

LSJ ἐλπίζω A2:
2. of evils, look for, fear, in same constr., “δύστανον ἐ. αἶσαν” S.Tr.111 (lyr.); “ἔξοδον ὀλεθρίαν Αἴαντος ἐλπίζει φέρειν” Id.Aj.799, cf. Lys.12.70; “τουτί . . τὸ κακὸν οὐδέποτ᾽ ἤλπισα” Ar.Av.956; “ἐ. πάγχυ ἀπολέεσθαι” Hdt.8.12; “θῆράς σφε τὸν δύστηνον ἐλπίζει κτανεῖν” E.Ion348: with μή folld. by aor. subj., “οὐδαμὰ ἐλπίσας μή κοτε ἐλάσῃ” Hdt.1.77; “οὐκ ἂν ἤλπισε μή κοτέ τις ἀναβαίη” Id.8.53.
http://www.perseus.tufts.edu/hopper/tex ... e)lpi%2Fzw

θαυμάζω ἑκατέρων τῶν ψήφων τὸν γεγονότα ἀριθμόν -- it's not clear to me whether θαυμάζω here takes both a genitive and an accusative complement, or whether ἑκατέρων τῶν ψήφων is simply a genitive depending on τὸν γεγονότα ἀριθμόν, but the meaning is clear.

Hope this helps.
Last edited by Hylander on Thu May 05, 2016 9:49 am, edited 1 time in total.
Bill Walderman

mwh
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Re: Plato Apology 35e1

Post by mwh »

I wrote what follows before seeing Hylander’s response—something that happens far too often. So it doesn’t take that response into account, sorry.

The μεν anticipates a δε that never comes. As if he were to say “Your verdict doesn’t piss me off—I expected it—in fact I’m only surprised the majority wasn’t bigger—I didn’t think it would be so close—in fact if only a handful of you had switched your votes ...” etc. By which time a corresponding δε clause has fallen out of prospect. The opening was set up for him to continue e.g. “but I do admit to being ever so slightly disappointed that you should have been so badly misled as to have found me guilty instead of recognizing me as your great benefactor deserving of all the honors you could throw at me” but we never get there. Ted Cruz’s withdrawal speech could have followed similar lines.

The construction is very loose, as if he’s extemporizing his response. The articular infinitive, το μη αγανακτειν, kicking off the sentence, is accusative, it turns out, but doesn’t have any very precise relation to the verb, συμβάλλεται. (“… combine so-as-to result-in not being cross”, the τό functioning much like ὥστε only vaguer.) The subject is άλλα τε πολλά. The τε leads us to expect a second subject following καί (e.g. το ουκ ανελπιστον ειναι μοι το γεγονος) but he starts a new independent clause instead. He’s saying the main reason the verdict doesn’t upset him is that he was expecting it. For αλλα τε … και, literally “both many other things combine and not unexpected …,” compare the recent thread on αλλως τε και: http://www.textkit.com/greek-latin-foru ... =2&t=64963, where I referred to the αλλως τε παντως (here αλλα τε πολλα, adj. not adverb) as “foil.” As others said there, “especially” usually makes a good translation. (“It doesn’t upset me [for a variety of reasons], especially because …”).

Hylander
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Re: Plato Apology 35e1

Post by Hylander »

δὲ is withheld until νῦν δέ in 36a
I wrote this, but it isn't quite right. δέ here doesn't pick up from the earlier μεν. νῦν δέ here means "but as it is . . . " (not "now"), and contrasts with the thought that precedes it: οὐ γὰρ ᾠόμην ἔγωγε οὕτω παρ᾽ ὀλίγον ἔσεσθαι ἀλλὰ παρὰ πολύ. "I didn't think the vote would be so close, but as it is, I would have been acquitted if I had just gotten 30 more votes." As mwh notes, S. loses the train of thought that led him to launch his post-conviction speech with τὸ μὲν μὴ ἀγανακτεῖν, and goes off in a different direction. Again, it's the illusion of extemporaneous speaking.
Bill Walderman

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