Search found 93 matches

by pin130
Tue Mar 19, 2019 2:07 am
Forum: Learning Latin
Topic: Latin word order
Replies: 25
Views: 2046

Re: Latin word order

I'm staggered by the prospect--writing all that 100 times over. After working the last thirty years with my hands, they're not as steady as they once were. I wonder if typing would make a similar impression on the mind, or maybe one must suffer a little more to succeed.
by pin130
Sun Mar 17, 2019 11:27 pm
Forum: Learning Latin
Topic: Latin word order
Replies: 25
Views: 2046

Re: Latin word order

I guess I was referring mostly to noun declensions and verb conjugations. Syntax is not so much a matter of memorization as it is a recognition of those "patterns" once you are aware they exit. I find keeping memorized lists in place in my mind over time the most difficult part. As for Hoyos, I made...
by pin130
Sun Mar 17, 2019 8:28 pm
Forum: Learning Latin
Topic: Latin word order
Replies: 25
Views: 2046

Re: Latin word order

OK, now I've read both posts from you, Randy, in the order they were written. Seven months of water has passed under the bridge since I was trying to read Caesar. I gave up in the chapter 13-14 area of book one, if I remember correctly, when the indirect discourse gets really heavy. I decided that y...
by pin130
Sun Mar 17, 2019 2:21 pm
Forum: Learning Latin
Topic: Latin word order
Replies: 25
Views: 2046

Re: Latin word order

Thanks Randy for your two posts. I saw the second before the first. I'll make another post when I have time to digest them.
by pin130
Fri Mar 15, 2019 2:18 pm
Forum: Learning Latin
Topic: Latin word order
Replies: 25
Views: 2046

Re: Latin word order

Thanks Callisper for your advice. I have strayed from composition, for the time being, because I'm going through M&F's Latin Intensive. I'll be happy if I can just translate the Latin into English as the book rapidly advances and with many exercises. The volume though is an advantage in that one see...
by pin130
Mon Mar 11, 2019 9:54 pm
Forum: Learning Latin
Topic: Latin word order
Replies: 25
Views: 2046

Re: Latin word order

Thanks for the links. I've printed out both pdf's. They both look of interest. I'm presently working through M&F's Latin Intensive
which is taking up all my language-spare-moments. The grammar therein is concise but clear.
by pin130
Sun Mar 10, 2019 4:29 am
Forum: Learning Latin
Topic: Latin word order
Replies: 25
Views: 2046

Re: Latin word order

I checked Github, searched for Harrington, but didn't find the title you suggested among the many Harrington possibilities.
Any way to narrow the search?
by pin130
Sun Feb 03, 2019 9:31 pm
Forum: Learning Latin
Topic: question about the hortatory subjunctive
Replies: 2
Views: 243

Re: question about the hortatory subjunctive

Thanks bedwere, I'd forgotten conor is a deponent verb. Which goes to show that although I've "finished" Nutting's Primer (thanks to nesrad's key) I haven't got it all memorized. In any case, I'm starting Nutting's First Latin Reader, for which there is no key to help.
by pin130
Sun Feb 03, 2019 8:13 pm
Forum: Learning Latin
Topic: question about the hortatory subjunctive
Replies: 2
Views: 243

question about the hortatory subjunctive

Nutting exercise 72: "Run, boys; lets all try to catch him" is translated as Currite, pueri; omnes eum capere conemur. I'm wondering why the word "try" is translated in the passive and not the active, perhaps a present subjunctive, as a hortatory
subjunctive?
by pin130
Sun Jan 27, 2019 8:02 pm
Forum: Learning Latin
Topic: relative pronoun used as demonstrative pronoun
Replies: 3
Views: 298

Re: relative pronoun used as demonstrative pronoun

Thanks hlawson38. I'd forgotten (more accurately: never memorized properly) that "quae" is also neuter plural. So in both cases, this and these, are referring back to a genderless situation and take the neuter. I still wonder if this is a general principle. And is it included in your quote from A&G?
by pin130
Sun Jan 27, 2019 4:29 am
Forum: Learning Latin
Topic: relative pronoun used as demonstrative pronoun
Replies: 3
Views: 298

relative pronoun used as demonstrative pronoun

Nutting exercise 62: Indi in silvam properaverunt. Quod cum vidissent... (translated as The Indians hurried into the forest. When the farmers saw this....). I understand that the relative pronoun "quod" is in the accusative (as a direct object of vidissent), but how does one determine the gender of ...
by pin130
Fri Jan 25, 2019 2:51 pm
Forum: Learning Latin
Topic: Audiofiles for "Roma Aeterna"
Replies: 5
Views: 519

Re: Audiofiles for "Roma Aeterna"

Check Mr. K's lingvalatina.com blog for some readings and grammar for Roma Aeterna.
by pin130
Sun Jan 13, 2019 2:47 pm
Forum: Learning Latin
Topic: problem with a cum clause
Replies: 6
Views: 565

Re: problem with a cum clause

Thanks Barry. I think another reason why I find participles difficult is that in text books, while nouns and adjectives are declined in full, participles are rarely declined so that one doesn't get familiar with their declined form. All that is initially recognized is the verbal root which leads to ...
by pin130
Fri Jan 11, 2019 7:41 pm
Forum: Learning Latin
Topic: problem with a cum clause
Replies: 6
Views: 565

Re: problem with a cum clause

Thanks Barry and mwh. After Barry mentioned the ablative absolute I did find that Nutting says it can take the place of a cum clause. Having almost finished Nutting (after Wheelock and Lingua Latina) I still get confused with participles. Since they feel and act like verbs I keep trying to conjugate...
by pin130
Fri Jan 11, 2019 3:20 pm
Forum: Learning Latin
Topic: problem with a cum clause
Replies: 6
Views: 565

problem with a cum clause

From Nutting's Primer, exercise 65: "When this was learned", said the soldier... The key translates this as Quo cognito, inquit miles. Why is this not treated as a cum clause with a subjunctive verb? What form is "cognito" (1st person passive participle?how would that fit in here?) In short, I'm con...
by pin130
Fri Jan 04, 2019 8:30 pm
Forum: Learning Latin
Topic: question about perfect and imperfect
Replies: 4
Views: 385

Re: question about perfect and imperfect

I see the difference, thanks
by pin130
Fri Jan 04, 2019 3:20 pm
Forum: Learning Latin
Topic: question about perfect and imperfect
Replies: 4
Views: 385

question about perfect and imperfect

From Nutting's Primer exercise 63: "We withstood the attack bravely for a long time," said the soldier; "for we thought that our general was hurrying..." "we thought" is translated in the key as putabamus. A few lines later: "suddenly we saw a great light and thought that the sailors were burning th...
by pin130
Wed Dec 05, 2018 2:09 am
Forum: Learning Latin
Topic: question about the subjunctive
Replies: 5
Views: 606

Re: question about the subjunctive

Would this be another such case? In Nutting exercise 52: "but when he heard the sea, he ran quickly to the boat...". The cum clause is translated as cum autem mare audiverat. Should this be audivisset?
by pin130
Sun Dec 02, 2018 1:04 am
Forum: Learning Latin
Topic: question about the subjunctive
Replies: 5
Views: 606

Re: question about the subjunctive

Not true what I just wrote. "When" doesn't have to be causal and often isn't (When I went to the store, the sun came out),
but a sentence like "When we saw the dead sailor in the woods, we ran to the farmhouse" I can only hear as causal.
by pin130
Sun Dec 02, 2018 12:07 am
Forum: Learning Latin
Topic: question about the subjunctive
Replies: 5
Views: 606

Re: question about the subjunctive

Thanks Bedwere. Such subtle nuances are not mentioned in the textbooks that I know of. I still have trouble though hearing the word "when" (cum) at the start of a clause without hearing a causal ring (excluding poetry where everything goes).
by pin130
Fri Nov 30, 2018 7:44 pm
Forum: Learning Latin
Topic: question about the subjunctive
Replies: 5
Views: 606

question about the subjunctive

Sorry to clog the forum with my elementary questions, but here goes another one. In Nutting exercise 51. "When the wolf heard the dogs, he also crossed the stream". A few lines later, "When we saw the dead sailor in the woods, said Marcus, we ran to the farmhouse". In the translation key, the cum cl...
by pin130
Wed Nov 28, 2018 4:44 am
Forum: Learning Latin
Topic: question about relative pronouns
Replies: 3
Views: 378

Re: question about relative pronouns

Yes now I see the difference between the first two and the third case--thanks Barry.
by pin130
Wed Nov 28, 2018 3:00 am
Forum: Learning Latin
Topic: question about relative pronouns
Replies: 3
Views: 378

question about relative pronouns

From Nutting exercise 50: We shall soon meet the hunter who lives in the woods....He often sits there in the shade to kill the wolves which come from the caves...Once he was able thus to catch a little bear, which he brought into the town. In the translation key "who lives" is translated as Venatore...
by pin130
Sun Nov 25, 2018 2:39 am
Forum: Learning Latin
Topic: Latin synonyms
Replies: 9
Views: 1162

Re: Latin synonyms

Thanks Interaxus for your suggestions. The Gradus ad Parnassum I find hard to read, literally, it's tough on my eyes. Just skimming it, it seems to be totally in Latin, with no English explanations. I'm afraid my Latin isn't up to it. On the other hand, I find the Dumesnil quite useful. After my ori...
by pin130
Mon Nov 19, 2018 3:14 pm
Forum: Learning Latin
Topic: Article on Extensive Reading
Replies: 3
Views: 743

Re: Article on Extensive Reading

I've no doubt extensive reading is very helpful, however each time (this is not the first time) I read this article I feel there is something--as they say--"unreal" about it. Wheelock 40 chapters in 40 days, Lingua Latina 7 times over, followed by Roma Aeterna 7 times over. What shall I say, this wa...
by pin130
Thu Nov 15, 2018 5:44 am
Forum: Learning Latin
Topic: question about possessive adjectives
Replies: 12
Views: 1180

Re: question about possessive adjectives

I have another question from Nutting 47, Aetos, If you still have your copy around. "Do you prefer to buy a doll, Claudia?" is translated in the key as Pupamne, Claudia, emere malis? Shouldn't "you prefer" be translated mavis? Malis is present subjunctive but isn't this a simple present tense second...
by pin130
Tue Nov 13, 2018 9:14 pm
Forum: Learning Latin
Topic: question about possessive adjectives
Replies: 12
Views: 1180

Re: question about possessive adjectives

Thanks to both of you for taking the time to answer my question. It's interesting that Nutting put (their) in brackets, implying that we know it's their mother we're talking about. Yet in exercise 44 "my" in the phrase my brothers is not put in brackets. I don't see why personal possession is more i...
by pin130
Mon Nov 12, 2018 10:40 pm
Forum: Learning Latin
Topic: question about possessive adjectives
Replies: 12
Views: 1180

Re: question about possessive adjectives

I came across the phrase "their mother" in Nutting 46, which is translated as mater eorum. Comparing this to fratres mei, would it be correct to say that with a 3rd person pronoun used as a possessive, the genitive "of" is not implicit and therefore must be added; with a 1st and 2nd person possessiv...
by pin130
Sun Nov 11, 2018 12:13 am
Forum: Learning Latin
Topic: Latin synonyms
Replies: 9
Views: 1162

Latin synonyms

Both fero and veho are translated as "carry", among other meanings. I couldn't easily find a subtle (or not so subtle) difference in the dictionary. Nor did I find them listed in Doderlein's Handbook of Synonyms. In Nutting's Primer they are both used for "carry", but I don't know why one is preferr...
by pin130
Thu Nov 08, 2018 12:13 am
Forum: Learning Latin
Topic: question about possessive adjectives
Replies: 12
Views: 1180

Re: question about possessive adjectives

Thanks. Amazing after several years of playing with Latin I still get stuck on these things. Oh well...
by pin130
Wed Nov 07, 2018 10:49 pm
Forum: Learning Latin
Topic: question about possessive adjectives
Replies: 12
Views: 1180

question about possessive adjectives

At the risk of asking a foolish question I've gotten stuck on a phrase from Nutting exercise 44: "my brothers have come from the boat...". My brothers is translated as "fratres mei" in the key. With 1st and 2nd person I thought you use the possessive adjective, yet "mei" is a pronoun genitive. If it...
by pin130
Wed Oct 31, 2018 2:03 pm
Forum: Learning Latin
Topic: Question about the genitive of possession
Replies: 3
Views: 649

Re: Question about the genitive of possession

Thanks Nesrad. But does this mean you choose which goes first by the way it sounds better to the ear?
What made you choose one way for these words and the other way for those words?
by pin130
Tue Oct 30, 2018 2:54 pm
Forum: Learning Latin
Topic: Question about the genitive of possession
Replies: 3
Views: 649

Question about the genitive of possession

I'm under the impression (maybe mistaken) that the genitive of possession goes before the thing possessed, such as "pueros ceteros ad lupi speluncam vocavit" the wolf's cave (Nutting exercise 42). Yet I've seen it turned around, such as in exercise 41: "go with them into the sailor's boat"--translat...
by pin130
Tue Oct 23, 2018 9:46 pm
Forum: Learning Latin
Topic: Translation question from Nutting exercise 39
Replies: 7
Views: 1120

Re: Translation question from Nutting exercise 39

Does that mean that if "cunis" is used without a qualifying adjective it necessarily means one cradle?
by pin130
Tue Oct 23, 2018 6:32 pm
Forum: Learning Latin
Topic: Translation question from Nutting exercise 39
Replies: 7
Views: 1120

Re: Translation question from Nutting exercise 39

Thanks very much for your answers. After I wrote the question I remembered that Nutting did mention the verb colloco is used with the ablative and not the accusative as might be expected. I did look up the word "cunae" and noticed that the genitive was given as cunarum, but I didn't know why. But if...
by pin130
Tue Oct 23, 2018 2:00 pm
Forum: Learning Latin
Topic: Translation question from Nutting exercise 39
Replies: 7
Views: 1120

Translation question from Nutting exercise 39

"Let's put two dolls in the cradle"--in the cradle is translated as "in cunis". Why is cradle singular translated with the plural cunis? Also, since "in" here means "into" why wouldn't the accusative be used?
by pin130
Fri Oct 19, 2018 7:16 pm
Forum: Learning Latin
Topic: question about the word "ceteri"
Replies: 8
Views: 1318

Re: question about the word "ceteri"

I had another question from Exercise 38. "I will give you beautiful flowers to put in your school bags."; beautiful flowers is translated as flores pulchras--since flores is masculine why does pulchras have a feminine ending? Also, to put in your school bag is translated as ut eas in capsis collocet...
by pin130
Thu Oct 18, 2018 4:39 am
Forum: Learning Latin
Topic: question about the word "ceteri"
Replies: 8
Views: 1318

Re: question about the word "ceteri"

I guess I thought of this as active since the phrase is from exercise 38 and Nutting doesn't begin mentioning the passive voice until exercise 54; also as was noted the Latin is active. So you see even a foolish question can have a certain methodology to it. I understand that the subject of "punishe...
by pin130
Wed Oct 17, 2018 9:54 pm
Forum: Learning Latin
Topic: question about the word "ceteri"
Replies: 8
Views: 1318

question about the word "ceteri"

Nutting exercise 38, English to Latin. "Three boys came to school today. Tomorrow the others will be punished." The key translates the second sentence "Cras ceteri poenas dabunt. Ceteri I suppose is masc., pl. nominative referring to "boys". But why wouldn't "others" be considered the direct object ...
by pin130
Tue Oct 16, 2018 3:40 am
Forum: Learning Latin
Topic: Question about the enclitic "-ne"
Replies: 4
Views: 1011

Re: Question about the enclitic "-ne"

Thank you very much bedwere, Barry, and Nesrad for answering my question.