Search found 952 matches

by Barry Hofstetter
Fri Aug 23, 2019 12:32 pm
Forum: Homeric Greek and Early Greek Poetry
Topic: Vacation reading
Replies: 10
Views: 179

Re: Vacation reading

Good. At its best this board makes it possible for a bunch of scattered people to be digitally in the same room together, and imagine if we were all resorting to the LSJ or Google in a conversation. I never really liked the Odyssey, except for the return. It doesn't have the magic or pathos of the ...
by Barry Hofstetter
Tue Aug 20, 2019 1:57 pm
Forum: Learning Greek
Topic: μὴ φύλαξ τοῦ ἀδελφοῦ μου εἰμὶ ἐγώ;
Replies: 3
Views: 157

Re: μὴ φύλαξ τοῦ ἀδελφοῦ μου εἰμὶ ἐγώ;

μή is regularly used for questions expecting a "no" answer in Greek (Latin regularly uses num). There are different ways to express this in English depending on context. Most beginning texts start by suggesting using the negated verb at the beginning with the verb repeated at the end as a question, ...
by Barry Hofstetter
Tue Aug 20, 2019 3:31 am
Forum: Learning Latin
Topic: Attested Latin words with three vowels in a row?
Replies: 13
Views: 339

Re: Attested Latin words with three vowels in a row?

Would praeeunte be treated as trisyllabic with correption of ae , or as disyllabic with synizesis of praee ? Let's see what Vergil has to say. Aeneid 5.186: nec tota tamen ille prior praeeunte carina Looks to me like it has to be disyllabic here. But is this simply metri causa, and it would be pron...
by Barry Hofstetter
Fri Aug 16, 2019 1:00 pm
Forum: Learning Greek
Topic: Helma Dik Word Order in Greek Tragic Dialogue
Replies: 1
Views: 152

Helma Dik Word Order in Greek Tragic Dialogue

Any thoughts on this, or anything to add to the Bryn Mawr review? It's on sale both Kindle and hard copy "insanely cheap" on Amazon.

https://tinyurl.com/yxfouh6t

The Bryn Mawr Review:

http://bmcr.brynmawr.edu/2008/2008-06-08.html
by Barry Hofstetter
Mon Aug 12, 2019 4:51 pm
Forum: Homeric Greek and Early Greek Poetry
Topic: Odyssey Reading Group: Book 6 Lines 211-238
Replies: 45
Views: 1866

Re: Odyssey Reading Group: Book 6 Lines 211-238

I continue to be perplexed by this distinction being made between "embarrassment" and " shame". Perhaps it is simply one of degree? I will continue to read about this and think further as clearly my understanding is wanting.. Shame has a connotation of wrongdoing or of not being up to a standard, w...
by Barry Hofstetter
Mon Aug 12, 2019 1:55 pm
Forum: Learning Greek
Topic: The Cambridge Grammar of Classical Greek
Replies: 29
Views: 5653

Re: The Cambridge Grammar of Classical Greek

Hylander wrote:
Mon Aug 12, 2019 1:47 pm
of course grammarians and linguists of Classical Greek have wholly rejected the idea of a tenseless verb for the language on empirical ground.
????
Exactly the right reaction. My first reaction on hearing this theory was "Have these people actually read any Greek?"
by Barry Hofstetter
Mon Aug 12, 2019 1:06 pm
Forum: Learning Greek
Topic: Republic 2.377a
Replies: 8
Views: 414

Re: Republic 2.377a

I assume that there is an implied εστι before ψεῦδος, and don't see any way that indirect discourse could be understood. (Does ἔνι always stand for a finite verb? I would think so, but I don't know.) ἐνί, poet. for ἐν, both Ep. and Att., also in Ion. prose. ἔνι, for ἔνεστι, ἔνεισι, ἐνέσται; v. ἔνει...
by Barry Hofstetter
Sun Aug 11, 2019 11:27 am
Forum: Learning Latin
Topic: Ablative of place without preposition?
Replies: 16
Views: 839

Re: Ablative of place without preposition?

Yes, it's an ablative of means. You've identified a general problem with simplifying Latin for didactic purposes. Sometimes the edited version may actually be somewhat more difficult than the original. The best way to get fluent at reading Latin is by reading what ancient authors actually wrote. Tha...
by Barry Hofstetter
Fri Aug 09, 2019 1:25 pm
Forum: Homeric Greek and Early Greek Poetry
Topic: Prayer from Iliad 7
Replies: 3
Views: 301

Prayer from Iliad 7

This prayer from Iliad 7 fascinated me: 202 “Ζεῦ πάτερ, Ἴδηθεν μεδέων, κύδιστε μέγιστε, 203 δὸς νίκην Αἴαντι καὶ ἀγλαὸν εὖχος ἀρέσθαι· 204 εἰ δὲ καὶ Ἕκτορά περ φιλέεις καὶ κήδεαι αὐτοῦ, 205 ἴσην ἀμφοτέροισι βίην καὶ κῦδος ὄπασσον.” Of course they want Aias to win, but then: "But if you do love Hecto...
by Barry Hofstetter
Fri Aug 09, 2019 12:42 pm
Forum: Homeric Greek and Early Greek Poetry
Topic: Odyssey Reading Group: Book 6 Lines 211-238
Replies: 45
Views: 1866

Re: Odyssey Reading Group: Book 6 Lines 211-238

My conclusion: remind my daughters to take an extra pair of men's clothes and bathing supplies, in case you meet a naked man at the shore who needs a bath. :shock:
by Barry Hofstetter
Tue Aug 06, 2019 3:19 pm
Forum: Learning Latin
Topic: Latin adjective rules
Replies: 6
Views: 399

Re: Latin adjective rules

Magnus referring to a person generally means "great" in a very broad sense, e.g., Ille Alexander magnus, Alexander the great. Rarely is it used of size in regard to a person -- one generally uses something like "ingens" or "procerus" or "crassus" for physical descriptions of that nature. Hylander is...
by Barry Hofstetter
Mon Aug 05, 2019 9:24 pm
Forum: Learning Latin
Topic: And another question regarding Hillard and Botting’s elem. exercises.
Replies: 13
Views: 721

Re: And another question regarding Hillard and Botting’s elem. exercises.

I couldn't get the link to work so can't read the footnote. Thanks for fleshing out your thinking on abstract/concrete. I am not someone who gets overly excited about dividing up exactly what sort of dative a particular construction is, although if one is teaching or trying to explain something it ...
by Barry Hofstetter
Mon Aug 05, 2019 3:22 pm
Forum: Learning Latin
Topic: And another question regarding Hillard and Botting’s elem. exercises.
Replies: 13
Views: 721

Re: And another question regarding Hillard and Botting’s elem. exercises.

@barry Perhaps my contribution was not as clear as it could have been. why does the first sentence use the dative case for the indirect object but the second sentence is expressing place to which for the indirect object when each sentence is practically the same with the exception of the main verb ...
by Barry Hofstetter
Mon Aug 05, 2019 2:59 pm
Forum: Learning Latin
Topic: Latin adjective rules
Replies: 6
Views: 399

Re: Latin adjective rules

When I first saw the title for this thread I thought it sad "Latin adjectives rule" and I was going to write a response in favor of the sovereignty of Latin verbs , but oh well... As it is, Latin adjectives agree with the nouns they modify in number, gender and case. That means they have to have the...
by Barry Hofstetter
Sun Aug 04, 2019 1:05 am
Forum: Learning Latin
Topic: And another question regarding Hillard and Botting’s elem. exercises.
Replies: 13
Views: 721

Re: And another question regarding Hillard and Botting’s elem. exercises.

Is that what makes the difference here on whether the indirect object will be in the dative case or expressed as place to which? The infinitive is the same in both sentences; and so is the direct object. Or did the answer key get one answer wrong? I think there has been a misunderstanding here. In ...
by Barry Hofstetter
Fri Aug 02, 2019 9:58 pm
Forum: Learning Latin
Topic: And another question regarding Hillard and Botting’s elem. exercises.
Replies: 13
Views: 721

Re: And another question regarding Hillard and Botting’s elem. exercises.

So what you’re saying is that there was no way of knowing whether the original sentence (in English) meant for it to be help in the abstract sense or in the concrete sense until I looked up the answer? That is, unless it specified that (which it doesn’t in this case though). This is the sort of thi...
by Barry Hofstetter
Fri Aug 02, 2019 2:42 pm
Forum: Homeric Greek and Early Greek Poetry
Topic: Odyssey Reading Group: Book 6 Lines 186-210
Replies: 26
Views: 1356

Re: Odyssey Reading Group: Book 6 Lines 186-210

Sometimes the language is just out and out beautiful (poetry, right?): τὸν νῦν χρὴ κομέειν· πρὸς γὰρ Διός εἰσιν ἅπαντες ξεῖνοί τε πτωχοί τε, δόσις δʼ ὀλίγη τε φίλη τε. ἀλλὰ δότʼ, ἀμφίπολοι, ξείνῳ βρῶσίν τε πόσιν τε, The threefold repetition of τε...τε I think is particularly striking. Question: what...
by Barry Hofstetter
Fri Aug 02, 2019 12:49 pm
Forum: Open Board
Topic: On Board TEXTKIT
Replies: 4
Views: 360

Re: On Board TEXTKIT

Salve, senex amice. My daughter was one of my students at a previous school where I taught. On quizzes and tests, students were required to write the teacher's name, and about halfway through the year, she began writing senex in the teacher name slot (I gave her extra credit and owned it). I'm using...
by Barry Hofstetter
Fri Aug 02, 2019 12:37 pm
Forum: Learning Latin
Topic: And another question regarding Hillard and Botting’s elem. exercises.
Replies: 13
Views: 721

Re: And another question regarding Hillard and Botting’s elem. exercises.

We should always be a little skeptical exegeting exercises from textbooks... :) But in this case, I think the first example looks at it as help in the abstract, sending help is the equivalent of giving help, and so the dative of indirect object. The second sentence views it as concrete, either the p...
by Barry Hofstetter
Tue Jul 30, 2019 9:53 pm
Forum: Learning Greek
Topic: Lysias 1.38
Replies: 4
Views: 340

Re: Lysias 1.38

Thanks Hylander for your reply and I take your point, as Barry Hofstetter's, about quoting text. My long-standing difficulty is always to try to "prove" answers to problems by reference to Smyth, Goodwin, etc,, and in this case neither authority seems to have an overt description of the syntax of o...
by Barry Hofstetter
Tue Jul 30, 2019 4:45 pm
Forum: Homeric Greek and Early Greek Poetry
Topic: Odyssey Reading Group: Book 6 Lines 162-185
Replies: 5
Views: 473

Re: Odyssey Reading Group: Book 6 Lines 162-185

I thought that it was interesting, in the light of Paul's comment in the previous thread about Odysseus promising to pray to Nausicaa as a god, that Phemios says that if Odysseus saves him then he will sing to him like a god (ἔοικα δέ τοι παραείδειν ὥς τε θεῷ·). Can ὥς θεῷ/θεῷ ὣς mean both "in the ...
by Barry Hofstetter
Mon Jul 29, 2019 2:52 pm
Forum: Learning Greek
Topic: Lysias 1.38
Replies: 4
Views: 340

Re: Lysias 1.38

Why don't you quote the actual text so we can have a look?
by Barry Hofstetter
Sat Jul 27, 2019 3:40 pm
Forum: Learning Greek
Topic: After Mastronarde
Replies: 15
Views: 1524

Re: After Mastronarde

Aetos wrote:
Sat Jul 27, 2019 1:24 pm
Hi Barry,
I'm currently working through Dickey. Are you referring to the Dickey threads here on Textkit or to other forums?
Yes. There's also a group that just started on B-Greek.
by Barry Hofstetter
Sat Jul 27, 2019 1:11 pm
Forum: Learning Greek
Topic: After Mastronarde
Replies: 15
Views: 1524

Re: After Mastronarde

Once again, thanks for all the help guys. Finally nearing the end of Mastronarde now (work got in the way!). I was wondering if anyone could point me in the right direction to improve Greek composition? They are the exercises that I have struggle with the most, feel that being able to write in Gree...
by Barry Hofstetter
Thu Jul 25, 2019 12:41 pm
Forum: Homeric Greek and Early Greek Poetry
Topic: Odyssey Reading Group: Book 6 Lines 141-161
Replies: 11
Views: 1072

Re: Odyssey Reading Group: Book 6 Lines 141-161

You have the Iliad line wrong, it should be 22.394. But the parallels you found disprove me to a point when I said that praying to a person is not traditional, even if it doesn’t disprove the rest. I wonder if it has any relevance that Hector, the greatest mortal protector of the Trojans, is alread...
by Barry Hofstetter
Thu Jul 25, 2019 11:01 am
Forum: Learning Latin
Topic: word order
Replies: 4
Views: 555

Re: Here's a modern take on Word Order

Here's a very recent take on word order. https://magisterp.com/2019/07/08/how-weve-been-wrong-about-latin-word-order/ I think this makes it more challenging :-) Jim Ah, no. This is based on an article written in 1918, one of the articles, I believe, that I cited above. Here are some fun facts from ...
by Barry Hofstetter
Wed Jul 24, 2019 2:53 pm
Forum: Medieval and Neo-Latin
Topic: Liber XXIV philosophorum
Replies: 3
Views: 609

Re: Liber XXIV philosophorum

Well, note that the English and the Italian translations do not say the same thing... The English translation you cite does seem to ignore unum altogether, which clearly modifies ardorem . The Italian translation is more entertaining, seemingly seeing a double entendre in the Latin ardor . 1) I thin...
by Barry Hofstetter
Wed Jul 24, 2019 12:40 pm
Forum: Learning Greek
Topic: Ἀθήνᾱζε Α, "Τὰ γὰρ πρόβατα ἐν τῷ αὐλίῳ ἑστίν"
Replies: 3
Views: 314

Re: Ἀθήνᾱζε Α, "Τὰ γὰρ πρόβατα ἐν τῷ αὐλίῳ ἑστίν"

Thank you, @bedwere. Unfortunately this is not signaled in the marginal notes. There'll probably be an explanation later in the book. An oversight, probably. I have taught Latin out of one book, however (Jenney) which does it deliberately, in the readings introducing a construction or vocabulary wh...
by Barry Hofstetter
Tue Jul 23, 2019 4:44 pm
Forum: Learning Greek
Topic: I am looking for bibliography
Replies: 1
Views: 222

Re: I am looking for bibliography

Any of the standard ancient Greek grammars will get you there, Smyth, Goodwin, or the recently published Cambridge Grammar of Classical Greek . Specifically on verb usage, I recently read The Syntax and Semantics of the Verb in Classical Greek: An Introduction: Third Edition by Rijksbaron, and it's ...
by Barry Hofstetter
Tue Jul 23, 2019 12:15 pm
Forum: Learning Latin
Topic: A better way?
Replies: 6
Views: 466

Re: A better way?

Reading neither grammar will hurt you, but if you read Latin grammars without reading Latin, you tend to get good at grammars and not so good at Latin. Even if you are not reading fluently, you want to proceed to reading real authors from antiquity as much as possible. That doesn't mean that there i...
by Barry Hofstetter
Mon Jul 22, 2019 9:43 pm
Forum: Learning Latin
Topic: Latin synonyms
Replies: 3
Views: 283

Re: Latin synonyms

Simply because some words may be translated by the same word in English in certain contexts does not mean that they mean the same thing.
by Barry Hofstetter
Fri Jul 19, 2019 7:14 pm
Forum: Koine and Biblical and Medieval Greek
Topic: Exodus 3:14 LXX and John 1:18
Replies: 6
Views: 766

Re: Exodus 3:14 LXX and John 1:18

I have no idea what you mean by "candidate answer." Do note, however, that there is better manuscript support for the reading than there was in W&H's time.
by Barry Hofstetter
Fri Jul 19, 2019 4:47 pm
Forum: Learning Latin
Topic: word order
Replies: 4
Views: 555

Re: word order

Some interesting articles:

https://www.jstor.org/stable/3288352?se ... b_contents

https://www.jstor.org/stable/3287962?se ... b_contents

But surely there is something more recent, especially with all the work being done in the latest fad of discourse analysis?
by Barry Hofstetter
Fri Jul 19, 2019 4:24 pm
Forum: Koine and Biblical and Medieval Greek
Topic: Exodus 3:14 LXX and John 1:18
Replies: 6
Views: 766

Re: Exodus 3:14 LXX and John 1:18

Thanks, Joel, that's great feedback, and any developed writing on the subject would have to interact with all this. Philo, of course, roughly contemporaneous with the composition of the NT writings, and whether or not he influenced any of the NT authors directly (now that's a hotly debated topic), a...
by Barry Hofstetter
Fri Jul 19, 2019 3:51 pm
Forum: Koine and Biblical and Medieval Greek
Topic: Exodus 3:14 LXX and John 1:18
Replies: 6
Views: 766

Re: Exodus 3:14 LXX and John 1:18

jeidsath wrote:
Fri Jul 19, 2019 3:03 pm
Does the world really need another thread about this?

I think that you may be right about ὁ ὢν but its usage in 2 John should give you some pause about being certain about anything.
Define "need..." :) However, could be more specific?
by Barry Hofstetter
Fri Jul 19, 2019 1:45 pm
Forum: Koine and Biblical and Medieval Greek
Topic: Exodus 3:14 LXX and John 1:18
Replies: 6
Views: 766

Exodus 3:14 LXX and John 1:18

Exodus 3:14 LXX Ἐγώ εἰμι ὁ ὤν· καὶ εἶπεν Οὕτως ἐρεῖς τοῖς υἱοῖς Ἰσραήλ Ὁ ὢν ἀπέσταλκέν με πρὸς ὑμᾶς John 1:18 θεὸν οὐδεὶς ἑώρακεν πώποτε· μονογενὴς θεὸς ὁ ὢν εἰς τὸν κόλπον τοῦ πατρὸς ἐκεῖνος ἐξηγήσατο.  It is well know that the second finite Hebrew verb in Exodus 3:14 MT, אֶֽהְיֶ֖ה אֲשֶׁ֣ר אֶֽהְיֶ֑...
by Barry Hofstetter
Thu Jul 18, 2019 12:05 pm
Forum: Learning Latin
Topic: accusative of possession??
Replies: 6
Views: 441

Re: accusative of possession??

This shows the danger of trying to infer what a latin phrase might mean from an English translation without having a grasp of Latin grammar. You would be better working your way through Wheelock rather than trying to dip in. In the long term it will save you time because you would have seen, for ex...
by Barry Hofstetter
Wed Jul 17, 2019 2:59 pm
Forum: Homeric Greek and Early Greek Poetry
Topic: Wilson's Odyssey - again
Replies: 16
Views: 992

Re: Wilson's Odyssey - again

I think we should always be a bit skeptical when someone uses an ad hominem to state that her work is better than someone else's. If her gender qualifies her to see things that male translators may have missed, does it also mean that she is missing things that her male counterparts are better qualif...
by Barry Hofstetter
Tue Jul 16, 2019 5:39 pm
Forum: Open Board
Topic: ΣΥΝΟΔΟΣ ΕΛΛΗΝΙΚΗ July 14–20, 2019 at the University of Kentucky, Lexington
Replies: 11
Views: 1406

Re: ΣΥΝΟΔΟΣ ΕΛΛΗΝΙΚΗ July 14–20, 2019 at the University of Kentucky, Lexington

θαυμαστόν τί μοι εἶναι δοκεῖ. νομίζεις ὅτι σοι ὠφέλιμον πολλὰ μανθάνοντι γέγονε;