Unit 12 Part III No. 7

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Lukas
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Unit 12 Part III No. 7

Post by Lukas »

Hello:

Here is an image of some examples of more prepositions for me to learn:
Image

With Part III, No. 7, I am supposed to write, "The sailors are going down along the river with difficulty, for they are being pelted with stones by the enemy. "
I wrote, "Ὁι ναῦτας κατὰ τὸν ποτεὸν χαλεπῶν, μετὰ ψὺφων ὐπὸ τῶν πολιμὶων Βὰλλουσιν." There are accents at syllables before the end that look like grave, but they should be acute.
Here is what the answer book wrote:
Image
I understand two mistakes I made:
1. I should have used the verb for "come" or "go".
2. I should have had "pelt" in the middle/passive voice.

I do not know why the answer book used the preposition, "ἀνὰ" rather than "κατὰ" as the the sailors went "down," not "up."
I also do not know why the preposition "μετὰ" was not included, as I was supposed to write, "pelted with," not just "pelted."
Λουκᾶς

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jeidsath
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Re: Unit 12 Part III No. 7

Post by jeidsath »

"The sailors are going down along the river with difficulty, for they are being pelted with stones by the enemy. "

Your version: Ὁι ναῦτας κατὰ τὸν ποτεὸν χαλεπῶν, μετὰ ψὺφων ὐπὸ τῶν πολιμὶων Βὰλλουσιν.
Book: ἀνὰ τὸν ποταμὸν χαλεπῶς ἔρχονται οἱ ναῦται· λίθοις γὰρ ὑπὸ τῶν πολεμίων βάλλονται

I think that you are correct with the first. It should be κατὰ for "down along."

λίθοις is an "instrumental dative" and means "with stones." μετὰ + gen. means "with" as in "together with" not "using".

Notice ναῦται (nom.), not ναῦτας. ποταμὸν not ποτεὸν. χαλεπῶς (adv.) not χαλεπῶν. I don't know what ψὺφων is meant for. πολεμίων not πολιμιων. βάλλονται passive, not βάλλουσιν active.
“One might get one’s Greek from the very lips of Homer and Plato." "In which case they would certainly plough you for the Little-go. The German scholars have improved Greek so much.”

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Lukas
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Re: Unit 12 Part III No. 7

Post by Lukas »

jeidsath wrote: Fri Apr 12, 2019 3:10 am "The sailors are going down along the river with difficulty, for they are being pelted with stones by the enemy. "

Your version: Ὁι ναῦτας κατὰ τὸν ποτεὸν χαλεπῶν, μετὰ ψὺφων ὐπὸ τῶν πολιμὶων Βὰλλουσιν.
Book: ἀνὰ τὸν ποταμὸν χαλεπῶς ἔρχονται οἱ ναῦται· λίθοις γὰρ ὑπὸ τῶν πολεμίων βάλλονται

I think that you are correct with the first. It should be κατὰ for "down along."

λίθοις is an "instrumental dative" and means "with stones." μετὰ + gen. means "with" as in "together with" not "using".

Notice ναῦται (nom.), not ναῦτας. ποταμὸν not ποτεὸν. χαλεπῶς (adv.) not χαλεπῶν. I don't know what ψὺφων is meant for. πολεμίων not πολιμιων. βάλλονται passive, not βάλλουσιν active.
I am trying to review datives and am getting confused. If the stone is an instrumental dative, would not "the enemy" also be an instrumental dative, since they are the instrument throwing the stones? I am getting very confused as to when to use a preposition and when to let the grammatical case do the work.
Λουκᾶς

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Barry Hofstetter
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Re: Unit 12 Part III No. 7

Post by Barry Hofstetter »

Lukas wrote: Sun Apr 14, 2019 1:38 am
I am trying to review datives and am getting confused. If the stone is an instrumental dative, would not "the enemy" also be an instrumental dative, since they are the instrument throwing the stones? I am getting very confused as to when to use a preposition and when to let the grammatical case do the work.
Dative of instrument is generally used with inanimate objects. It's the tool or instrument used to perform an action. The enemy are people, the agents actually performing the action, and so genitive of agent with ὑπό.
N.E. Barry Hofstetter

Cuncta mortalia incerta...

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seneca2008
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Re: Unit 12 Part III No. 7

Post by seneca2008 »

I don't know what ψὺφων is meant for.
Perhaps OP had in mind “ψῆφος“? Presumably the enemy were exercising their democratic right to resist? :D
Persuade tibi hoc sic esse, ut scribo: quaedam tempora eripiuntur nobis, quaedam subducuntur, quaedam effluunt. Turpissima tamen est iactura, quae per neglegentiam fit. Et si volueris attendere, maxima pars vitae elabitur male agentibus, magna nihil agentibus, tota vita aliud agentibus.

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