134

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amans
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134

Post by amans » Sun Aug 07, 2005 10:24 pm

χαίρετε

I am working through White, and I have a question (I'll probably be back later with many more).

The sentence is from 134: καὶ τισσαφέρνης διαβάλλει τον κῦρον πρὸς τὸν ἀδελφὸν ὡς ἐπιβουλεύει αὐτῳ

My translation goes: and Tissaphernes slanders Cyrus ... that he is plotting against him.

My problems are:

- How would you translate πρὸς τὸν ἀδελφὸν. I guess it is the accusative which surprises me here.

- I fail to see how ὡς-clause works with the rest. What does it express? Why does it not require the subjunctive?

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Paul
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Post by Paul » Sun Aug 07, 2005 10:40 pm

Hi amans,

[size=150]πρὸς τὸν ἀδελφὸν[/size] = 'to his brother'.

For this use of [size=150]ὡς[/size] see entry B in the middle LSJ.

Cordially,

Paul

Bert
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Re: 134

Post by Bert » Sun Aug 07, 2005 10:52 pm

[size=150]τὸν ἀδελφόν[/size] is accusative because of the preposition [size=150]πρός [/size].
He is slandering Cyrus toward his brother.
We don't say slandering 'toward' someone in English but it gets the point of the accusative across.
Did you expect to see the Gen. or the Dat.

I am working through White as well.
When I saw this sentence I figured [size=150]ὡς[/size] meant as.
The footnote in White indicates that it should be 'that'. There is quite a difference in meaning here.
I don't know why it should have the subjunctive. It serves the same purpose as [size=150]ὅτι[/size]. If it said [size=150]ὡς ἄν[/size] it would be followed by the subjunctive, just like [size=150]ὅταν [/size]would.

amans
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Post by amans » Mon Aug 08, 2005 7:22 am

Thanks a lot for your swift replies, Paul and Bert :D

With regard to the ως -clause: I reckon it is a causal clause then: since he plots against him.

With regard to the πρὸς τὸν ἀδελφὸν : yes, I expected the dative (thinking an indirect object would have been in place, had this not been a prepositional phrase).



post scriptum: how far have you come in White, Bert?

Bert
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Post by Bert » Mon Aug 08, 2005 11:43 pm

amans wrote:

post scriptum: how far have you come in White, Bert?
I (we) just finished lesson 20.
I am going through it with the White-a reading group.
Paul replied while I was writing a reply, so I did not see his.
There was not realy a need for me to write anything in addition to what he wrote but it felt good that I was able to help someone with what I learned just a few weeks ago.

amans
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Post by amans » Tue Aug 09, 2005 12:05 am

Bert wrote:
amans wrote:

post scriptum: how far have you come in White, Bert?
I (we) just finished lesson 20.
I am going through it with the White-a reading group.
Nice. I am coming along, but it is sure a steep climb.
Paul replied while I was writing a reply, so I did not see his.
Has happened to me too in the Latin forum.
There was not realy a need for me to write anything in addition to what he wrote but it felt good that I was able to help someone with what I learned just a few weeks ago.
I am glad you did, though. I am not quite sure about the subjunctive in Greek. I have Latin ut-clauses in my head: a bit confusing . . . Anyway, thanks again.

:D

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