Cicero, Academica, I, hard sentence

[hlawson38]

Context: The Academica is a dialogue by Cicero featuring himself and the scholar Varro. In the beginning of the dialogue, "Cicero" promotes his project of carrying over into Latin the philosophy of the Greeks. To this point, "Varro" seems skeptical about the prospects of this effort.

I had much trouble with this fragment:

"Varro" speaking:

nostra tu physica nosti; quae cum contineantur ex effectione et ex materia ea quam fingit et format effectio, adhibenda etiam geometria est. . . .

(cut and pasted from here: http://www.thelatinlibrary.com/cicero/acad.shtml)

Translation ("Varro" speaking):

You know about our theories of nature [nostra . . . physica]. They ought to be framed by [the principle of] efficient cause and by the matter that efficient cause molds and shapes. They [the theories of nature] should also have applied to them [the discipline of] mathematics [geometria].

readings:
physica: neuter plural, accusative
quae: relative pronoun, mominative, neuter, plural, agrees with physica in gender and number
contineantur: the subject is quae. The subjunctive here expresses intention.
adhibenda: agrees with physica, future passive participle
effectio: efficient cause

[mwh]

That seems about right, Hugh, except that I read the subjunctive as being controlled by cum (causal), and I take adhibenda to be nom,.sing. in agreement with geometria, to give something like “Since these cover efficient cause and the (ea) physical matter that the efficient cause fashions and gives form to, geometry has to be brought in too.”

[hlawson38]

Many thanks mwh. I'll study your reply.

[hlawson38]

That seems about right, Hugh, except that I read the subjunctive as being controlled by cum (causal), and I take adhibenda to be nom,.sing. in agreement with geometria, to give something like “Since these cover efficient cause and the (ea) physical matter that the efficient cause fashions and gives form to, geometry has to be brought in too.”

Many thanks again, mwh. After going over the sentence, I see that I overlooked the singular "adhibenda . . . est". This sentence presented many difficulties for me; in this situation I often overlook something. After I saw it, with your help, it became hard to understand how I could have missed it.

[Constantinus Philo]

nostra tu physica nosti; quae cum contineantur ex effectione et ex materia ea quam fingit et format effectio, adhibenda etiam geometria est. . . .
You know our physical doctrines; since they are composed of the efficient cause and this matter, which the efficient cause fixes and gives form to, even geometry should be applied. Is this correct?